5-Way PVC Tee & rung spin capabilities??

[Steve King (Admin)]

From their now extinct website, there is "NO" patent # currently on hand.


Filed doesn't mean have. Therefore, there will be NO current infringements until a patent # is presented.

Steve

[gman]

You are absolutely 100% correct

And Joel2018 is Joe from spinit, account was created sep. 5th 2005. He will be using that user name to try to scare the knock-offs away from ebay by threat of legal action. He also is user: spinitgame.

Steve I did a search for your auction that you ended. I have to tell you a link to a fitting that can be bought at a hundred websites is absolutely not patent infringement.

A patent document contains a description of the invention (usually with drawings), which explains how the invention can be built and how it works. It also contains a set of specific "claims". The claims define what the inventor seeks to protect with his patent. So, for something to infringe on a patent, it needs to match the definition given in the claim.

Patent laws in most countries require some sort of commercial exploitation of the patented invention for the exploitation to be patent infringement. So, a private person can infringe if he, for example, makes the invention and sells it to his friends, or puts it on an advertisement-sponsored website. But if he makes it for himself out of curiosity, and only uses it himself, there is no infringement.

So by definition alone, showing someone where to buy an off the shelf component so they can make their own version of a patented product is by no means patent infringement.

Being that we are talking about “spinit” lets continue our example. Let’s say that they really do have a patent. Buy altering the patented item so that it no longer matches the claim of the original patent, you may now file for a patent on the new design. This is a common practice that happens every day. It only becomes infringement when you copy the exact patent claim. So for “spinit” to say that a game made with four (4) rungs is in direct violation of its original claim is false.

Let me explain in more detail, for “spinit” to say and I quote “We did not specify the number of rungs on the wheel, knowing someone would try to make a similar game.” Would be a complete violation of patent laws, patent claims must be specific, and patent drawings must be specific to the letter.

So if a patent is held for a five (5) rung spinning game, then an infringement must actually violate a trademark, or an exact duplication of the claims. If you want to get a patent on a 3,4,6,7,8 rung spinning game you will be awarded the patent if none exists. Also if you want to make a five (5) rung game that would only spin in one direction or had curved rungs or moved the rung support arms from the center of the device to the front, you would be awarded a patent.

If the patent office left a patent open no one but Henry Ford could ever make a car. Ford could say that Chevy was in violation because Chevy has four (4) wheels. Do you see how this works? Chevy can make an almost identical product as long as it’s just a little different. But they can’t use a ford logo or exact body style. Look at all the cars on the road today, how many of them have four wheels? How many of them look almost but not exactly like a model made by another car company? This is true from cars to blenders to any product you can find.

This is one of the primary reasons design patents are worthless. You spend 4 to 5 years and up to $35,000 dollars. And all you really get is a piece of paper saying you invented something. Then the next guy comes along and makes a small modification to your idea and gets a patent on it. Sure it pisses you off but there is nothing you can do about it.

[Steve King (Admin)]

Thank you for your response and phone call gman. This has been very very informative. I understand Joe's/Gary's stance with the spin it game, but look at the Ladder Golf game and all of the knock-offs on Ebay and retailer links for such game linked at the bottom of this forums main page. I don't even think the Spin It guys can stop whats coming down the pike. Lots and lots of knock-offs, patent or not, for the spin it game. Yes, and exact duplicate would be a violation of patent (if he ever gets a patent #), but until then, it'll be a free for all, and even if he does get a #, it'll still be a free for all selling knock offs due to what you stated above. Any slight variation will not be an infringement.

Steve

P.S. Good analogy with the car makers!

[Field Of Dreams]

WOW

Have you all seen the new SPIN IT design with only 8 pieces of pipe...looks amazing...www.spinitgame.com

Field of Dreams

[Buggs41]

....Yawn......Yes I have seen it.

Excuse me if I don't seem more intrigued about that 'plug.' ( Chewing on aluminum foil is more exciting at this moment. )


EDIT: What I am trying to say in the above post, is if you want to plug the game, at least log in as a real user. Links are already in place on the board to direct new customers your way. Every forum I have belonged to frown on advertising within the forum pages. A link can be added if the admin is contacted, and it is agreed upon.

Looks like a great game. I hope the patent process has started on this new design. The old one will not hold up.

P.S. Is that guy shacking up with a new lady? She doesn't look like the one included in the original game photo. If this is the same family, congrats on the doctor that made the boy look like a healthy girl.

Keep grinning! ;D

Buggs41

[Steve King (Admin)]

Buggs,

Looks like the maker dropped some serious money to make pre-formed curved PVC pieces. I suppose they are trying to spread the word, but if they want a serious plug by we experts, lol, then they need to send you, I and gman a complimentary game, since we were the first 3 to inhabit this board and talk about their game. I'm sure our chats have sent a few sales their way, eh?

Steve

[Buggs41]

Steve,

I am ready, willing, and able to give their game a decent plug. But I need to play it first.

As you stated, Gman, you, and I are the only ones qualified to undertake the painstaking beta test of this new model.

Prior to this test, a neutral course needs to be determined. I suggest Hawaii. All transportation, and refreshments, to and from the event should be paid for by the sponsor.

I will sit by my computer until the itinerary is posted.

[Grant]

How about using a round piece of 3/8 in. plywood, or aluminum in place of the "6 way" fitting. About a 12" diameter piece, drill a hole in the center large enough for the contraption to fit over the support rod, use two carriage bolts and wing nuts for each piece of pipe. Viola. May take a little more time to assemble, but wouldn't be that expensive. If you really wanted to get fancy, you could put a bearing at the center to make it rotate easier.

[Grant]

Thinking a little more, use the 3/8" plywood or aluminum (whatever), and bolt the female adapters for the pipe to the "disc". Now you can slip the "rungs" into the fittings, and not have to bother with the bolts and wing nuts. Just my $.02

[Steve King (Admin)]

I'd love to see a drawing of this idea. Sounds like a great cost effective concept! Thanks for your .02 cents!

Steve

[Shaolin Monk]

All the parts in that last pic can be bought at home depot for next to nothing.

[fudge]

I created my own 5-way spining hub. We are going to try it this weekend at a family re-union.
I went to my local hardware store (Menards) and picked up all the pieces to make a 'standard' ladder golf set, and a whole bunch of extra half inch pvc and connectors.
I used the plans to make a 2 foot wide ladder, with 3- 1 foot vertical posts on each side. Then I took 5- 1/2 inch couplers and sanded the ends with a 1 5/8 drum sander attachment for my drill press. This makes a curve at the end that fits a 1 inch coupler. I very carefully glued the 5- 1/2 inch couplers around the 1 in coupler. I really goobered the glue all over. After letting the glue set overnight. I glued a 3/4 inch coupler inside the 1 inch coupler.
This makes 1 5-way spining hub and you will need 4.
Then I cut 20 - 12 inch lengths of pvc and 10 - 18 inch lengths.
And 20 elbows, for the spinning part.

Instead of bending the PVC, like in the real spin-it, I create 10 U's and stick them in the home-made 5-way spining hubs (5 for each side)
oh, we also painted the 18 inch bars for scoring.
Now I can play the standard ladder golf, or remove the top and bottom bars, and use the middle bar to play the spinning version.

The first ladder golf set I made, we used golf balls. But this time I found some medium-hard rubber balls at the local 'dollar' store.
They already had holes through them and all I had to do was add the rope. I have about 15 inches between the balls. Just enough so you can't quite be on two bars at the same time.

I will let you know if the glue holds, after this weekend.

[Tricia (Admin)]

Sounds great! We would LOVE to see a photo of your creation. One of the game itself and one of a close up of the 5-way. If you don't have the photos hosted online, you can always email them as an attachment to:

[e-mail]

[Tricia (Admin)]

Here are the pictures of Jeff's (Fudge's) 5-way creation:




The hub is made with 5 - 1/2 inch couplers with the ends sanded on a 1 5/8 drum sanding attachment for his drill press. These are glued to a 1 inch coupler, then a 3/4 inch coupler is glued to the inside.



He used 1/2 inch PVC for the ladder, it is "bouncier" so it makes the game a littler more difficult.

[Crustyboom]

Thank you SOO much for sharing. That looks awesome. I have recently become addicted to the original ladder game. We recently went camping and ppl asked us to show our game to the director of the camp so that they could make some for the campers to play next year. Everyone was really fascinated with the game. When i saw this version of the game I became really interested. I appreciate you sharing your set up. I do have a question though, i was just wondering if you had to put anything extra in the hub to allow it to spin? or does it just spin b/c you have the 1/2 in pipe go through it?? Did you just use the middle pipe and run that through the two hubs??

Thank you again for sharing. It looks awesome.

[fudge]

I use my standard ladder and remove the top and bottom rung. I haven't glued anything together. I then put the two hubs on the middle rung. The hub center hole size is just a little bigger than the 1/2 inch PVC. So it spins nicely without any modification. Then I connect all the spinning rungs. The hubs are approx. an inch from the T's on the vertical bars. We played all afternoon last Saturday and it works great. Once in a while, we had to reconnect the spinning rungs. I need to drill some holes and put pins in to keep the spinning rungs from coming loose.

[Joe]

I love the design for the spinner. However, it seems like an awful lot of work to do with PVC. Why not make them out of chunks of scrap wood? I intend to try just that and if it works out OK I will post the details and perhaps a picture.

Joe in WI

[honeebear30]

i was wondering does anyone have the plans to make one of these and where can i get them to make instead of spending alot of money on ebay or that guys site. you can email me at [e-mail]

[Steve King (Admin)]

There currently aren't any plans online except the details spoken about and pictures provided within this thread.

[Steve King (Admin)]

There is another way to make a spinning ladder, so I've found. As you will see in the photo below, one can screw and eye-screw into the bottom of a piece of PVC, then insert a bolt with a head larger than the eye through the eye and double-side nut it into a multi-port PVC adapter.













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